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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 7:28 am 
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Cngratulations Richard!, :applause: I knew it wouldn't take long to take the lead... :sun:
And as Glyn pointed out, you solved also some "ambiguity" in the sorting, it is NOT easy to imagine how those romans understood "order" :scratch: but Matt seems to have some Roman blood ancesters :o
Your turn now to post next one :study:

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 8:02 am 
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Just to make time, while Richard warms up and prepares his "challenge" :shh:
a couple of paragraphs from the entry in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_numerals :study:

Although the Roman numerals are now written with letters of the Roman alphabet, they were originally independent symbols. The Etruscans, for example, used I Λ X ⋔ 8 ⊕ for I V X L C M, of which only I and X happened to be letters in their alphabet. One folk etymology has it that the V represented a hand, and that the X was made by placing two Vs on top of each other, one inverted. However, the Etrusco-Roman numerals actually appear to derive from notches on tally sticks, which continued to be used by Italian and Dalmatian shepherds into the 19th century.

Thus I descends not from the letter I but from a notch scored across the stick. Every fifth notch was double cut (i.e. ⋀, ⋁, ⋋, ⋌, etc.), and every tenth was cross cut (X), IIIIΛIIIIXIIIIΛIIIIXII…, much like European tally marks today. This produced a positional system: Eight on a counting stick was eight tallies, IIIIΛIII, or the eighth of a longer series of tallies; either way, it could be abbreviated ΛIII (or VIII), as the existence of a Λ implies four prior notches. By extension, eighteen was the eighth tally after the first ten, which could be abbreviated X, and so was XΛIII. Likewise, number four on the stick was the I-notch that could be felt just before the cut of the Λ (V), so it could be written as either IIII or IΛ (IV). Thus the system was neither additive nor subtractive in its conception, but ordinal. When the tallies were transferred to writing, the marks were easily identified with the existing Roman letters I, V, X.

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 11:05 am 
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Oscar wrote:
... but Matt seems to have some Roman blood ancesters :o

I'm laughing so hard reading that line... :lol: :D :cheesey: You wouldn't make that comment if you knew my origin... ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 4:51 pm 
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udosuk wrote:
I'm laughing so hard reading that line... :lol: :D :cheesey: You wouldn't make that comment if you knew my origin... ;)


Is this going to be a future teaser?

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 6:55 pm 
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OK ladies and gents

You've had it too easy up to now . . . is this senidenary check sum correct? If so, why? If not, why not?

314086807350

[BTW - I haven't seen any takers yet for my numerical crossword The Paddock]


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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 5:32 am 
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rcbroughton wrote:
OK ladies and gents

You've had it too easy up to now . . . is this senidenary check sum correct? If so, why? If not, why not?

314086807350

I take it "senidenary" means "hexadecimal". Here is the number in other bases:

DEC: 54153204233040
OCT: 1424020640071520
BIN: 1100010100000010000110100000000111001101010000

Is it relevant that the decimal representation has only the digits 0..5?

rcbroughton wrote:
[BTW - I haven't seen any takers yet for my numerical crossword The Paddock]

I've saved it and had a few brief looks but it seems to be a major homework for a long holiday. :study:

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 6:34 am 
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udosuk wrote:
I take it "senidenary" means "hexadecimal".
Correct
Quote:
Here is the number in other bases:
. . . assuming the original is in hexadecimal . . .
Quote:
Is it relevant that the decimal representation has only the digits 0..5
The puzzle is consistent with the others in this thread in the span of digits covered


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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 10:38 am 
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rcbroughton wrote:
is this .... check sum correct?
I know nothing about any of this - but from reading Wiki, I think this is a virus/tamper check.
udosuk wrote:
Here is the number in other bases:
rcbroughton wrote:
. . . assuming the original is in hexadecimal
And the number given may have been effected by a virus.
udosuk wrote:
Here is the number in other bases:
DEC: 54153204233040
OCT: 1424020640071520
BIN: 1100010100000010000110100000000111001101010000
As I said, I don't understand any of this. But, according to here
http://www.paulschou.com/tools/xlate/
Code:
HeX (decode)
314086807350
Text
1@†€sP
Binary
00110001 01000000 10000110 10000000 01110011 01010000
Base 64
MUCGgHNQ
[u]Dec/Char[/u]
49 64 134 128 115 80

Also tried
Code:
Text (encode)
314086807350
Binary
00110011 00110001 00110100 00110000 00111000 00110110 00111000 00110000 00110111 00110011 00110101 00110000
Hex
33 31 34 30 38 36 38 30 37 33 35 30
Base64
MzE0MDg2ODA3MzUw
Dec/Char
51 49 52 48 56 54 56 48 55 51 53 48

Hmmm. How important is virus?

Cheers
Ed


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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 11:05 am 
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314086807350

Assuming this is in decimal base, converting it into hexadecimal base:

(HEX) 4921085736

The digits 0..9 each appear once.

No idea about the "check sum" technical bit though... :scratch:

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 Post subject: Re: Brainteaser thread
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 11:14 am 
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udosuk wrote:
(HEX) 4921085736 . . . The digits 0..9 each appear once.
Now we're getting somewhere . . .

Quote:
No idea about the "check sum" technical bit though... :scratch:
Not strictly a check sum - more a check sequence

Additional Hint:
There is a spelling error in "check sequence"


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